Conjo wrote:.

Given the above, I have lots of questions. Here are a few:.

1. Should the in camera work space be sRGB or AdobeRGB? I initiallythought the former, then a tutorial on the Canon site said to use thelatter because of it's wider gamut. Does that make a difference if I'mshooting in RAW? I'm planning to work in AdobeRGB in Photoshop. Goodidea or bad idea?.

SRGB is for web publishing, you can see the difference from the following example:http://www.photo96.com/blog/?p=30.

2. I'm converting the RAW files with DPP. Should I convert to 16-bitTIFF, and process the TIFF in Photoshop? Aren't TIFFs lossless asopposed to JPEGs?.

I will convert the RAW in Photoshop if I want to play with the color..

3. What should be the default value of my output resolution (for myown inkjet prints only - nothing going to CMYK)? I've heard 240 and360 dpi. Thoughts?.

Match to you printer's dpi. For example, the printer is 600 dpi, you want a 4x6 print, to get the best result, you should resize the picture to 600*4 x 600*6 (2400 by 3600), then apply sharpening. Here is the values that I used all the time:http://www.photo96.com/tr/ps/usm_01.htm.

4. What processing should I do in DPP (executed during conversion?)and what should I wait to do in Photoshop? For example, any reason tocrop (if necessary) in DPP? Should I be messing with the tone curvesin DPP, or wait for Photoshop? And in either case, any suggestionsfor how best to learn how to manipulate tone curves? Good tutorials?.

I only use DPP for wildlife picture. Keep the original color and the sharpening is slightly better than Photoshop (especially on feather)..

5. For B&W, would there be a problem with shooting with a colorpicture style and then desaturating in post? Does it matter if I usethe monochrome picture style in camera if I'm shooting in RAW? Myunderstanding is that with a RAW file, you can retrieve the color inpost..

With the RAW file, you can do anything. Here is an example:http://www.photo96.com/blog/?p=242.

That's it for now. I know with all these questions I might as welljust ask you to shoot the pix for me. But I have to start somewhere....

TIA.

YongboPhoto Gallery: http://www.photo96.com/.

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You are welcome.YongboPhoto Gallery: http://www.photo96.com/.

Image control:Zoom outZoom 100%Zoom inExpand AllOpen in new window..

Before I continue... because you wrote in Beginners section, my answers apply as such -to avoid bad surprises .

Conjo wrote:.

1. Should the in camera work space be sRGB or AdobeRGB? I initiallythought the former, then a tutorial on the Canon site said to use thelatter because of it's wider gamut. Does that make a difference if I'mshooting in RAW? I'm planning to work in AdobeRGB in Photoshop. Goodidea or bad idea?.

Set your camera to sRGB. Only advanced photographers use other color spaces (because they know why and how to manage that). I'm quite sure your monitor can show only sRGB and so does your printer (and photo labs expect sRGB by default). You can decide for other colorspace later if/when you feel need (and learn how) to use it.In short: colorspace on all devices must match -otherwise colors will be wrong..

If you shoot raw, then you can convert your image to any colorspace later. Still, when you take (raw) shot, camera writes a tag into image file, which tells what color settting you had in camera. For example:if you set AdobeRGB on camera, some converter may show you image in AdobeRGB automatically. As said, for raw, this can be changed anytime..

2. I'm converting the RAW files with DPP. Should I convert to 16-bitTIFF, and process the TIFF in Photoshop? Aren't TIFFs lossless asopposed to JPEGs?.

It's your decission to what you convert. If some image is allready good, then you can convert it straight to jpeg (ready to print). If you think image need further manipulation, which can't be done in DPP, then you should convert to tiff: 8 or 16bit. After that you manipulate it in Photoshop (or whatever) and convert to jpeg (for print or web)..

Jpeg is lossy format. That means, during conversion, you loose something. How much? Depends on compression (quality setting) factor. Believe me, if you use low compression (hi quality), then you won't see (much) difference..

Tiff is lossless format, which results with larger files. This format is usually used if you wish to post-process image in some photo editor. Obviously 16bit tiff preserves more data than 8bit does, but files can be huge. There has been a lot discussion here, about which to use -so you decission. In short: your monitor can't show 16bit colors -it will show in 8bit (same for printer). So why 16bit? Because internally, Photoshop, etc., uses 16bit values.



3. What should be the default value of my output resolution (for myown inkjet prints only - nothing going to CMYK)? I've heard 240 and360 dpi. Thoughts?.

Do you have any printed (film) photos from labs? They are printed at 300ppi by default... and they are quite good, ain't they? Anyway, don't confuse DPI, PPI and resolution -learn how those values interfere with each other..

4. What processing should I do in DPP (executed during conversion?)and what should I wait to do in Photoshop? For example, any reason tocrop (if necessary) in DPP? Should I be messing with the tone curvesin DPP, or wait for Photoshop? And in either case, any suggestionsfor how best to learn how to manipulate tone curves? Good tutorials?.

Do what you find necessary to be done to get the best photo. In my case (amateur too), I get final (jpg) result straight from DPP -in such case I use all needed settings in DPP (brightness, saturation,..), because I know it will be final. If I see some special treatment will be needed (good noise reduction, for example), I don't do much in DPP -just convert to tiff and continue from there.How to learn? Try and observe what you get. Learning never ends....

5. For B&W, would there be a problem with shooting with a colorpicture style and then desaturating in post? Does it matter if I usethe monochrome picture style in camera if I'm shooting in RAW? Myunderstanding is that with a RAW file, you can retrieve the color inpost..

If you shoot raw, photo is taken in color anyway. Getting BW photo is postprocessing task. If you shoot BW jpg, then photo is converted in camera -you can't get colors back anymore..

Final.. at first you may find interesting to play with all those (photo) tools, applying all those settings. So here's the advice: try to get final result with minimum work -because the goal is to have photos, not work on them..

BogdanMy pictures are my memorieshttp://freeweb.siol.net/hrastni3/..

1 - Adobe RGB can cause problems. If you profile everything for it then you wont know what everyone else is seeing if you share. All that said, I use Adobe RGB but dont always care if my shared photos look exactly right and dont enter many contests. I agree you should start in sRGB at least until you get into color management seriously..

2 - As long as you save the original raw file as your negative it doesnt matter. For something special like a large print 16 bit might be worthwhile, but it takes a lot longer to edit twice the time if you have lots of RAM and much longer if it runs you out of RAM and you revert to virtual memory. I see no reason to extract anything as a JPG that is going to get any editing..

3 - You should have no default output for printing. Crop for your print size with the resolution box empty. Then check what resolution you ended up with and resample higher only if you have to. Processing for a set output involves a resample and you want to avoid that..

Ive run several tests with my photo printers and prints from a Fuji Frontier system. I see no improvement over around 240 PPI from various printers or photo processors, even under magnification. I think the latest 1 picolitre printers are using 128 dots per pixel and the printer makers have been really stingy with white papers. Even if you start with 64 dots per pixel the old LPI rule of 2X for high quality output gives too low a PPI, so I cant suggest a formula..

You should do your own tests. Tests to get a comparison of native resolution are a little fussy to get exactly the right crop but worth the effort. You should also start with lower resolutions and upsample to 300 PPI to see what improvement you get with the upsample from various resolutions. I think you will find the upsample doesnt give dramatic improvement. I dont usually upsample until I fall below around 180 PPI, but you might feel differently. Compare apples to apples and think the tests through..

4 White balance is best done in conversion IMO. I personally prefer Photoshop for everything else but dont use the same converter..

I had an old raw converter that had a combined curves and histogram. Im still using CS but Adobe hasn't integrated the two up to that. A free plugin called Smart Curves is the best tutorial I can recommend if you already understand levels. It works fine in Photoshop: http://free.pages.at/easyfilter/curves.html.

5 If you are shooting raw you might as well extract as a color TIFF and convert in Photoshop unless your converter has something special for B&W you find superior to Photoshop...

Yongbo wrote:.

You are welcome.YongboPhoto Gallery: http://www.photo96.com/.

Image control:Zoom outZoom 100%Zoom inExpand AllOpen in new window.

1. Is that true? You can shoot in sRGB and it can be an Adobe RGB image in RAW? I was unaware that RAW could do that. That's the question..

2. The caution is that PS 7 does not really have the ability to do much editing in 16 bit. Later versions of PS have incrementaly added the ability to work in 16 bit..

Dave..

1. Is that true? You can shoot in sRGB and it can be an Adobe RGBimage in RAW? I was unaware that RAW could do that. That's thequestion..

The only controls that are significant shooting raw are ISO, focus, aperture and shutter speed. Everything else is just a processing command which you can duplicate in the software. Starting with raw you can choose any color space your converter is capable of..

2. The caution is that PS 7 does not really have the ability to domuch editing in 16 bit. Later versions of PS have incrementaly addedthe ability to work in 16 bit..

Another is that unless you bought Adobe Camera RAW separately the suggestion to use Photoshop for the conversion is inappropriate as well. Ive seen workarounds for doing some things in version 7 in 16 bit with workarounds, but it is a lot of trouble...

I forgot to mention the upsample method. If I have to upsample for printing I usually double my PPI, which usually gives me more than I need. The printer spooler will do another resample and eliminate what it cant use, but the printer spooler will resample no matter what PPI you upsample to. There might be an exception to that if you can find a white paper to tell you exactly what PPI your spooler doesnt resample but dont take someones word from a post. Their math always seems to be based on conjecture..

An upsample to a multiple is claimed to be better because Photoshop doesnt have to average out the original pixels. Rather than double the PPI it is better to double one of the pixel dimensions or use 200% with constrain proportions checked. Photoshop rounds and it is possible to get a resample of the original pixels using multiples with the PPI. The difference is more noticeable using multiples for a downsample because the image isnt resampled at all you just eliminate pixels but the ones remaining are the originals. This isn't possible if the height or width is not evenly divisible and using 50% or 25% doesn't correct that, nor does halving or quartering the PPI..

I usually upsample with Genuine Fractals, but if I am making a large print I compare the results with stepped interpolation. SI increases in increments of 2% or 5%. I usually use 2% but 5% is more practical if you dont have plenty of RAM. I have actions made to do that. Sometimes the SI upsample looks better than GF and sometimes the other way round. You might try making some SI actions if you don't have Genuine Fractals. Some people upsample with bicubic smoother and downsample with bicubic sharper, but you dont have those choices with version 7...

Slipe wrote:.

1. Is that true? You can shoot in sRGB and it can be an Adobe RGBimage in RAW? I was unaware that RAW could do that. That's thequestion..

The only controls that are significant shooting raw are ISO, focus,aperture and shutter speed. Everything else is just a processingcommand which you can duplicate in the software. Starting with rawyou can choose any color space your converter is capable of..

I would have thought to have known that. Thanks for making me feel like an idiot....

Couldn't you have just plain out lied to spare my tender ego? .

Dave..